Showing posts with label Demographics. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Demographics. Show all posts

Saturday, January 7, 2017

Another Europe: Sunday Mass Attendance Rises in Poland to 40 Percent

The Other Europe:  Polish Mass Attendance Climbs
(Warsaw) There is "another Europe". The latest figures from Poland make it clear. The number of visitors to Sunday Mass has risen to 40 percent in 2016.
According to the statistical institute of the Catholic Church in Poland, the proportion of visitors in the survey population increased from 39.1 percent in 2015 to 39.8 percent in 2016. The number of Communion recipients rose from 16.3 percent to 17 percent, as Pawel Rytel-Andrianik for Zenit reported.
Poland has one of the densest parish nets in the Catholic world. About seven percent of all parishes are run by religious orders. 92 percent of Poles profess the Catholic faith. The number of priests working in parishes is almost 21,000. More than 7,000 religious are also active in the parishes.
In 2015 369,000 baptisms and 270,000 First Communions were offered and 134,000 marriages were consecrated. The figures point to a healthy, positive demographic development.
In more than 60,000 parishes around 2.5 million believers are active. A further 1.8 million believers are voluntarily active in the social sector, in child care, disability facilities, schools and hospices.
Polish catholicity is characterized by a rich Marian tradition and diverse forms of popular piety. The rosary and liturgical functions, which are based on the Marian works of Fatima, play a particularly strong role.
Text: Gerda Weiser
image: Il Timone
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com
AMDG

Thursday, May 26, 2016

Migrant Keeps German Town in Fear -- Police Are Powerless

[Wangen] A 20 year old asylum seeker from Gambia has terrorized the  Swabian municipality of Wangen  for weeks. Almost daily there are charges  of the man harrassing, stealing, threatening  or resisting police officials, say reports of  the Schwäbische Zeitung.

Most recently, he shouted at a woman in the street for no reason and threatened her with a bottle, rioted in a police cell and severed cable in his refugee center. Again and again, the asylum seeker is released. The police are powerless by their own account. "Many of the legal offenses do not stick, he moves in a gray area, which we must accept as fact," said Wangen police superintendent Wolfgang Gerke.

Although the man is now banned  at several local asylum centers, because of his contacts in the community this allows him to return regularly back to the city. At present, the situation was "satisfactory", Gerke admitted. However, the police keep close contact with the courts and city. (Ho)

Text: Junge Freiheit.
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com

Thursday, April 7, 2016

UK: Record Numbers Attend Immemorial Mass in UK During Easter Triduum

Edit: in light of various complaints based on unsubstantiated data by the usual professional mourners for the Church's demise , you know who you are, there is some really positive news coming out of the UK that Easter services for the Triduum have enjoyed record numbers!  Mr. Joseph Shaw of the Latin Mass Society was quoted in the Catholic Herald, which unfortunately insists upon prosaically calling the Immemorial Mass of All Ages, the "Extraordinary Form":

[Catholic Herald] Across Britain more than 200 older form Masses were celebrated over Holy Week. These included Easter Sunday Masses at both Norwich and Portsmouth cathedrals.

LMS said attendance in key parishes such as Warrington and Preston were up by at least 20 per cent from last year.

Joseph Shaw, chairman of LMS, said: “”We are delighted at the number of Easter Triduum services celebrated in the Extraordinary Form this year.”

Shaw added: “The growing numbers present at Extraordinary Form celebrations of the Easter vigil this year underline the continual growth we are experiencing all over the country in attendance at the Traditional Mass.”

Tuesday, March 15, 2016

New Map Shows Mass Locations Since Summorum Pontificum


Map of Europe with Mass Locations of the Traditional Mass 

(Rome) The French side ProjectSP5 published a map of Europe which includes the Mass  locations of the traditional Mass.  ProjectSP5 standa for Project Summorum Pontificum. The map highlights the spread of the traditional Rite, which Pope Benedict XVI has restored the traditional Rite again to its official right of residence in the world Church. 

Distinct Geographic Differences 

A glance on the map immediately shows significant geographic differences between the various European states.  Strikingly thick are the Mass locations in France, England and the German language area, less dense are the Catholic nations of Poland, Italy, Dpain and Portugal. Some
Counties, notably Ireland, we're not included.
The traditional Rite is thus more prominently represented in those areas where the Catholic Faith has been historically endangered by great pressure.  That was true for England though the long Anglican state persecution, for France through radical secularization and for the German speaking areas through the Church schism of the 16th century, which separated both the people and the state, and in the last half-century from a protestantizing in progressive Church circles.

Map Documents Counter-Reaction

The "Rheinisch Alliance" from the leading German and French speaking bishops and theologians are in this area and worked a massive influence on the Second Vatican Council. The consequences were an inner-Church break, which has not been resolved and has thrown the Church into a difficult crisis. 
The maps with the Mass locations documented in the same area as the reaction to this development and gives the impression of the vitality of faith and the Church.
The also shows a significant shortcoming. Some Mass locations are missing, others are imprecisely located on the map. . A more precise and comprehensive map, "would be desired and would make the implementation and effect of the Motu proprio Summorum Pontificum of  Papst Benedict  XVI",  says the traditional site  Messa in Latino. The project of the French blogger is still a noteworthy beginning.
Text: Giuseppe Nardi
Bild: ProjectSP5 (Screenshot)
Trans: Tabcred vekron99@hotmail.com
Link...
AMDG 

Wednesday, July 22, 2015

Erosion of the German Church -- Gäswein: "Shepherds Must Not Make Decisions Based on Media Applause"

Flashmob in Rio... Reduced to Ridicule
(Rome / Berlin) The Catholic Church in Germany has experienced a record number of almost 218,000 leaving the church last year. 39,000 more than the year before.
More even than in 2010, when the German Church was shaken by the sexual abuse scandal of minors and was under massive public pressure.
The figures highlight a sideshow: Between 2005 and 2013 Pope Benedict XVI was  annually blamed, if there wasn't  a merely  local "culprit", who could share the blame, like  Bishop Krenn in Austria or the bishops Mixa and Tebartz-van Elst in the Federal Republic of Germany.

Church Exit Numbers Were Instrumentalized Against Benedict XVI. - Since silence

"Controversial actions of Pope Benedict XVI. were to blame"  the "like exclusion of homosexuals ", "lack of equality for women"  or the "lifting of the excommunication for Lefebvrian bishops"  which was said, for example in 2010 by the Austrian pastoral theologian Paul Zulehner (Vienna) and Episcopal Vicar Willi Vieböck (Linz). But there has never been when all things are considered, more leaving the Church than under Pope Francis. Since then there is an awkward silence until the  among the wordy Church representatives and the media. Their "interpretations" are subsequently exposed as a church-political instrumentalisation.
In the Federal Republic of Germany, Church membership is directly coupled to tax aspect. The recognized denominations demand and  are payed the so-called "church tax", which is calculated and charged by the state  and sent to the churches.

Church-tax Secures Influence

The money supply is enormous. In 2011 alone, took the Catholic Church in Germany took in about 5.8 billion euros.
With 1.3 million employees, the Catholic Church is  the second largest employer in Germany next to   the public sector. The largest private company, Siemens, employs just over 400,000 employees.
With the bulging coffers, the German Church exerts considerable influence in the Third World.

Majority of the German Bishops Want to Change the Doctrine of the Church

Some commentators, such as the American George Weigel, writing of the growing erosion process, in addition to financial reasons, describes the tendency of most of the German bishops to trying to change the doctrine of the Church.
This includes marriage and sexual morality, especially the doctrine of the right to access the sacrament of marriage and the Eucharist. Concretely it  applies to the recognition of  second marriages and the admission of remarried divorcees to communion. It is exactly these issues that the Synod of Bishops will address this October.

What Curial Archbishop Geogr Gänswein Says

"It is interesting to hear what Curia Archbishop Georg Gänswein, Prefect of the Papal Household and private secretary of Pope Benedict XVI. has to say in a far more extensive interview," said Marco Tosatti. Interview by Jaume Figa i Vaello for the Catalan and Spanish website +1 Sumant Hostories of the Universitat Internacional de Catalunya .
Question: Some of these issues come from your native Germany. Why?
Archbishop Gänswein: Yes. It is true that not all the errors come from there, but the point in question is provided as follows: 20 years ago John Paul II  rejected, after a long and laborious negotiation,  that divorced and remarried would have access to communion.. We can not simply go and change things established in our Magisterium.
Question: Why do some shepherds want that  which is not possible?
Archbishop Gänswein: I do not know. Maybe they give in to the Zeitgeist, perhaps they can be  led by  the applause of the people, which is made by the media ... to be critical of the mass media, is certainly less enjoyable. A shepherd must not decide on the basis of whether the media applauds or not. The benchmark is the Gospel, the Faith, sound doctrine, Tradition.
Text: Giuseppe Nardi
Image: Mil
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com
AMDG

Friday, July 17, 2015

The Numbers Leaving the Church in Germany Are Climbing



The German Bishops' Conference has published the number of people leaving the Church in 2014. After 178,805 in 2013, 217,716 people have left the church in the following year. An increase of 20 percent! This is topped by the Protestant Church

Munich (kath.net/pm) The German Bishops' Conference (DBK) are in the midst of silly season this Friday and the dioceses have reported the Church statistics in 2014 and again this is explosive, because the number of leaving the Church has risen significantly again. After 178,805 people left in 2013, 217,716 people have left the church in 2014. That's an increase of about 20 percent. Church attendance has risen with an increase of 0.1 percent to 10.9 percent. The total number of priests is 12,219 (2013 12,336). The number of pastoral assistants is at 3,171 (2013: 3,140) which increased slightly as did the number of community workers at 4,526 (4,470 in 2013). Cardinal Reinhard Marx commented in a press release: "The statistics released today show that church is multiform and is a missionary force, even if we are made painfully aware of the high number of people leaving the Church, that we do not reach people with our message, there are personal life decisions behind the number of leaving the Church that in each case we profoundly regret but also respect the freedom of choice. We will strive to continue our mission credibly to gather so that we can proclaim the joy of the Gospel and many people will find a home in the community of church. The faith joy and momentum of Pope Francis has given us a great help. We want to be on the move with him 'raising' the church in Germany, to actively bring the people for God's sake in community and gives testimony of the great message of the Gospel."

The numbers leaving the Catholic Church are still comfortably topped by the Protestant church. There 410,000 people have left. According to the EPD deaths are also here included, however. They do not wish to publish exact numbers at present. Thus, the Catholic German Bishops' Conference counted 23.9 million members at the end of 2014, the Evangelical Church in Germany (EKD) approximately 22.63 million.

Link to Kath.net...
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com
AMDG

Tuesday, June 23, 2015

Union Between Both Ukrainian Orthodox Churches Separated From Moscow

Patriarch Filaret
(Kiev) The two non-canonically recognized Orthodox churches of Ukraine have agreed to merge. On September 14, the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Kiev Patriarchate will unite under the leadership of Patriarch Filaret and the Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox Church, headed by Metropolitan Macarius in a Union. In Ukraine there are three Orthodox churches, each raise the claim to be legitimate representative of Orthodoxy. Only one of the three churches is canonically recognized, namely the Ukrainian Orthodox Church by the Moscow Patriarchate. The other two churches are considered in Orthodoxy to be schismatic. This refers to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Kiev Patriarchate, which broke away in 1991 in the wake of Ukraine's independence from Moscow. Similarly, the Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox Church, originated in the 1920s during the anti-communist struggle for freedom in Ukraine. Both see themselves as autocephalous churches of Orthodoxy, but this was not previously recognized by the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople and the canonical Orthodoxy.

No Exact Figures on Membership of the Three Orthodox Churches of Ukraine

Precise details relating to religious and confessional affiliation are missing. All information is in agreement that the vast majority of Ukrainians consider themselves Christians, and among them, the Orthodox are most numerous. Less well known is which of the three Orthodox communities do Orthodox Ukrainians feel they belong. Even less is known about the displacements, which have occurred within the Orthodox community by the civil war in eastern Ukraine. Observers say that the war had strengthened the commitment to the Kyivan Patriarchate.

The Moscow Patriarchate and the Kiev Patriarchate should now represent in each case about 25 percent of Ukrainians. The Autocephalous Orthodox represent a share of 2-3 percent.

Treaty of Union Between the Two "schismatic" Ukrainian Churches

The Kiev Patriarchate and Autonomous Orthodox Church have now decided to unite. The ceremony will take place in Kiev Saint Sophia Cathedral on the 14th of September. The two Churches hope the merger will receive recognition from the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople. A representative of the Ecumenical Patriarch was present at the signing of the Treaty of Union, and certified the contract by signing. The Union shall be called Ukrainian Autocephalous Church of the Kiev Patriarchate. The merger will bring more clarity in the Ukraine, but also raises new questions. It is still unsettled who will head the Union. The Autocephalous Church has not yet agreed that the 80-year Kiev Patriarch Filaret is recognized as a leader. It could also require the election of a head. Between Kyiv and the Moscow Patriarchate in 2014 talks about a reunion had been decided, but which have not yet been implemented. The Moscow Patriarchate has not commented on the Union plans. The merger is without a signal to recognize the authority of Moscow, could burden the search for the unity of Orthodoxy at the pan-Orthodox Council of 2016.

15 percent of Catholics Centered in Western Ukraine

The share of Latin and Greek Catholics is 15 percent of the population. More than 12 percent of Ukrainians belong to the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church united with Rome. Other two and a half percent to the Latin Church.

The evangelical and Pentecostal communities have grown since the independence of Ukraine. Some of the missionary activity is carried out directly from the United States. The Russian occupied or at least majority Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine (the east and the border with Moldova) have a significantly higher number of registered evangelical groups. Statistics, where the registered churches are located, however, do not reflect the actual number of believers again.The proportion of various Protestant communities in the total population is estimated at about fifteen percent. The lowest share they have is in western Ukraine in the areas where the majority Greek Catholic areas. Plus, there's around four per cent Muslims, mainly Tatars, 0.2 percent Jews and as many members of other religions.The rest are atheists and agnostics.

Text: Giuseppe Nardi Image: Orthodoxy Trans; Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com

Link to Katholisches...

AMDG

Saturday, March 15, 2014

Pro Missa Tridentina: Traditional Latin Mass in Germany is Growing

Edit: here's an excerpt from an article on Regina Magazine interviewing Monika Rheinschitt of Pro Missa Tridentina.

Monika Rheinschmitt is a trained computer scientist. These days, however, she keeps a weather eye on some numbers she couldn’t have imagined in her university days — developments in Catholicism and the growth of the Latin Mass in the German-speaking world.

Monika is the Stuttgart-based Director of Pro Missa Tridentina, one of the most active organizations on the planet to practically support the Latin Mass. Since 1990 she has been the editor and publisher of a traditional newsletter, in 2010 upgraded to the magazine “Dominus vobiscum”, which is published twice a year and avidly read in Germany, Alsace, Switzerland, Austria, Liechtenstein, Belgium and the Netherlands.
DSC_5792-1a
An Interview with Monika Rheinschmitt of Pro Missa Tridentina in Germany
Hers is not an easy job, not the least because in these countries the Latin Mass faces an unimaginable uphill battle. In Germany and its neighboring lands, secular attitudes range from indifferent to hostile about the idea of religion itself. Within the Church, both traditional teachings and the traditional rite are often suppressed, ignored or ridiculed in ways that might astonish outsiders.
Even though the numbers of Mass-goers and Catholics continue to drop precipitously in these countries, there seems to be little awareness on the part of Church leadership of the significant power of the Extraordinary Form to attract converts and indeed to bring Catholics home again. (For more about the German church see here.)
Against this background, the gains that the Latin Mass has made are a testimony to the true grit of Catholics, laity and clergy alike. In this exclusive interview withRegina Magazine, Monika gives us a view into her world.
Q. Tell us about Pro Missa Tridentina. When was it founded, and by whom?
Pro Missa Tridentina was founded in Stuttgart in Spring 1990 as an association of  laypeople dedicated to the care of the Traditional Latin Rite of the Catholic Mass. We work to promote this “Vetus Ordo” by supporting Catholic laity who wish to be able to assist at this beautiful rite. That includes the organization of trainings for priests, altar servers and choirs as well as practical help finding locations for the Mass – and from writing letters to the local bishop to preparing the first celebration of a Traditional Latin Mass.

Thursday, January 16, 2014

Austria: More Leaving Church Under Pope Francis Than Under Benedict XVI


(Vienna) in Austria in 2013, there were more than leaving the church than in 2012. Nearly 55,000 Catholics have left the Catholic Church as a corporate body under public law. Thus more Austrians left the Church in the first year of the pontificate of Pope Francis, than in the last year of the pontificate of Pope Benedict XVI. The church leaders wonder about this phenomenon, which they had not expected.
"We would have expected better numbers," said the Bishop of Linz Vicar William Viehböck. Following the resignation of Pope Benedict XVI. there was  relief heard from not a few official church authorities in Austria. The reasons are to be sought in the different understanding of the Church. The election of Pope Francis was greeted with cheers. Since then everything will "different" and "better". But the harsh reality has caught up to the diocese now.

No "Bergoglio Effect" -Church Leaders Puzzle

After the election of the new Pope a "a palpable mood swing" had occurred,  says Viehböck. The "mood" does not seem to be of the desired type. A "mood" seems to be no solid foundation for the Church. At the management level, one tries to maintain optimism and push the "Bergoglio effect" to the next year. Negative events would prove to act  even "faster" than positive, says Vicar Viehböck consolingly.
The increase in leaving the Church does not fit the image. It dampens the alleged "change of mood". By leaving the numbers regularly leaving the Church  seen driven by   progressive church policy   in recent years. The withdrawals were attributed to real and fictitious scandals or  the "conservatives" were blamed. Once the fault was because Bishop Kurt Krenn was appointed Bishop of Sankt Pölten, then the alleged "abuse scandal" of Vienna's Archbishop Cardinal Hans Hermann Gröer or because Pope Benedict XVI. wanted to appoint the "hardliner" Pastor Gerhard Maria Wagner as Auxiliary Bishop of Linz.

Numbers of People Leaving Church Exploited by  Progressive Church Policy

The new figures refute this transparent, but black and white image, thanks to support of the media. In recent years  leaving the church had been interpreted by "appointed" sides as an "outcry" against "the log jam" and "backwardness", yet there is currently a conspicuous silence. Church districts which are faithful have been demanding a fact-based analysis for years.  The individualization and dissolution of Church affiliation will be only be promoted rather than stopped by the progressive agenda with destruction of the liturgy, attenuated evangelization efforts and a staff that is no longer really Catholic, but speak in the name of the Church in public.
The increase in withdrawals is 4.8 percent. The percentage of Catholics in Austria's population has thus declined   to a record low. From a Church perspective an exit from the Church is not possible. Through a serious act that violates church doctrine and order, believers can suffer excommunication and therefore the exclusion from the ecclesial community. [Especially if they don't want to support the Liberal Tax-Church regime with its poorly managed healthcare facilities, liturgical abuses and shoddy catechesis.] This need not be explicitly imposed, but occurs automatically upon the act.
Text: Giuseppe Nardi
Image: Catholic Church in Austria
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com
AMGD

Thursday, January 9, 2014

Number of Christians Has Quadrupled in Russia Since the End of the Soviet Union

(Moscow), 25 years after the collapse of communism and 23 years after the end of the Soviet Union, the number of Russians who profess to be Christians, quadrupled. The critical  situation of religious freedom remains in some countries of the former Soviet power.
In 1989 it was known  that not more than  17 percent of Russians professed Orthodox Christianity. Since then, it has grown as much as four times. Today, 68 percent of Russians refer to themselves as Russian Orthodox.The most recent ones were released by the independent Levada Center on the 15-18th November of the previous year conducted a survey in 130 cities.
Until a few months before the dissolution of the Soviet Union atheism was regarded as the official state ideology. 75 percent of the population of Russia at that time described themselves as atheists. As early as 1991, that number had fallen to 53 percent. According to the results of the Levada poll today,  not even 19 percent confess as atheists. In third place are professing Muslims, whose number has increased from six percent in 1991 climbing to seven percent in 2013.
Despite the impressive return of Orthodox Christianity, 70 years of state atheism has left strong traces, as the Historian and Political Scientist Andrei Zubov emphasized: "70 years of state atheism can not be overcome in  one day."  The number of Christians actually practicing  is still low. The commitment to Orthodox Christianity is above all cultural and historic in nature.  It is part of Russiandom. The Levada poll found that only four percent of Orthodox Christians attend the Divine Liturgy every Sunday. 17 percent attend the Divine Liturgy only at the high festivals. 35 percent of respondents said that they had never set foot in a church in their lives. Since 1991  83 percent of all respondents said they have never received the Holy Communion, but they are  now considerably fewer, but still 62 percent.
The Russian Orthodox Church has been building years many new churches and have tried  to rechristianize those cites which became "atheist" during the Soviet era. "We are not able to build as many churches as we would like and would need", says the "State Department" of the Moscow Patriarchate.

Religious freedom at risk

While Russia's commitment to Orthodox Christianity is experiencing a renaissance, the free exercise of religion in several Soviet Republics, which are sovereign independent States today, remains underdeveloped. In the name of "national security", Kazakhstan restricted freedom of religion in 2011.  An infringement can be severely punished.  Religious publications are subject to government censorship. The construction of churches is strictly regulated. Bibles and other religious books are confiscated, as well as icons and religious representations. They are what the state classifies as "extremist materials".
The situation in Uzbekistan is even more critical. The population is mainly Muslim, Christians are a minority. Their religious life is subject to a number of limitations. In 2013 Christians complained that reading the Bible is forbidden even in prison. The situation is similar in Turkmenistan.
Text: Giuseppe Nardi
image: Tempi


Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com
AMGD

Sunday, September 1, 2013

Refurbishing the Cultural Landscape --- 2,800 Churches May Disappear in France

(Paris), France's Mayors are tearing down Catholic churches to build parking lots or shopping centers. The renovation costs were too high. 2,800 churches will disappear in this way, according to a report by the French Senate.

In France, the dispute over the demolition of Catholic churches is not new. They are dilapidated and abandoned. And yet, every time a church is to be razed to the ground, it raises fierce protest from the population. "People feel that more than just some walls are broken. You feel a substantial change in their environment, their culture and thus of their own being,” wrote Claude Villot who is not under suspicion of Ultramontane sympathies.

Recent cases listed the Catholic daily La Croix on: Saint-Blaise du Breuil in Allier, St-Pie-X in Hérault, Saint-Jacques d'Abbeville in Somme (pictured) and Saint-Pierre-aux-Liens in Gesté in the department Maine-et-Loire. The number of demolished since 2000 in France is estimated by the Catholic Church at 20. Another 250 could soon follow. According to a report by the French Senate, the number of churches that are destined to disappear from the French countryside is estimated at 2,800. Most of them are located in rural areas.

"Fewer priests, Fewer Faithful, Less Demand," this is the new mantra of local politicians

"Fewer priests, measuring less and less practicing believers, therefore less need to obtain large churches, when a chapel would be enough." This is the new mantra, wrote Guy Massin Le Goff, memorial preservationist, in his 2009 report La polémique autour de la démolition of églises: le cas du Maine-et-Loire. It is this formula that compels many French communities to use demolition instead of a preferable refurbishment. Through the numerous, revolutionary interventions, which have transpired in the French history on church property, transferring to the state, many churches are owned by the municipalities.

“The use of churches calculating only the use of Masses, Sundays or on weekdays, would not properly represent the reality" the expert said. "A church is not just a place that is open to the Eucharist, or for baptisms, weddings or funerals. That it is used primarily for personal prayer of the faithful. The lit candles prove that there are diverse and numerous reasons to knock at the church door, whether alone or in small groups,” said Massin Le Goff, who sharply criticized the mayor of Anjou, one of the historic landscapes of French Catholicism, because of the ease with which they decide to demolish churches. In some cases, a dilapidated house of God is simply assumed to be able to implement new building projects, in whose way the church stands.

"What Would this Place be Without its Church?" - What Does Not Bring “Profit", Must Go

Massin Le Goff recalled that in most cases, the village was built on the church and not vice versa. Demolishing the church is meant to tear her heart and wipe out its own past. "What would this place be without its church?", such the first question that arises as Massin Le Goff, to whomever will listen. As as example, the preservationist cites the decision of the General Council of Maine-et-Loire, who also provides funds for the renovation of churches that are not listed on the historic register.

For Beatrice de Andia, founder of the Documentation Centre For Religious Heritage what is most disturbing about what happens in France: "For the first time we are destroying places of worship for no apparent reason, to make room for parking lots, restaurants, shops, places or apartments. The message of the demolitions is clear: the religious, the sacred, cultural heritage, which brings no gain, must go away. The destroyers present themselves as worthy managers who are concerned about the municipal treasury, which, according to them, would not bear the cost of the renovation of the church. "Maintenance” is but a duty for the mayor,” said de Andia.

Country Parishes Reduced Dramatically - Fewer priests, More Deacons: Opposite Tendency

One of the reasons for the "light" demolition orders, is the progressive decline of priests in France. In 2001 there were, according to officials of the Episcopal Conference, 24,251 diocesan and religious priests. In 2008, there were only 19,640, of which 15,008 were diocesan priests. Their number on 31 December 2011 (new statistics are not yet available) dropped to 13,822. In 2011, there were 13,630 parishes. In recent years, new parishes were established by the bishops to reflect changes demographic. The new parishes are concentrated in the cities, especially on the edges, while the rural areas became increasingly orphaned. There, the parishes were dramatically reduced by merging two or more parishes. At the top of the large territorial parish is a priest, but increasingly deacons are involved, the number of which grows in the opposite tendency to the decrease of the priests. And in many areas also lay people.

Text: Giuseppe Nardi
Image: Heritage-religieux
Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com

AMGD

Link to katholisches...

Monday, July 22, 2013

Post Card From the Sugar Loaf --- Catholics Are a Minority in Rio

(Rio de Janeiro) Pope Francis is on a flight to the area's largest and most populous country in Latin America. The Catholic Church's leader will undertake his pastoral visit to Brazil up to the 29th of July. The reason is World Youth Day, which takes place this year in the Brazilian Atlantic metropolis of Rio de Janeiro.

The Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life of Washington has shown a graphical representation of the religious development of the Brazilians in the past 40 years.

Brazil is the country with the most Catholics worldwide. 123 million Brazilians profess the Catholic Church. It was not until half a century ago virtually the entire population Catholic, the proportion of Catholics since the Second Vatican Council has plummeted. From 92 percent in 1970 to 65 percent in 2010.

At the same time the Protestants experienced an equally unexpected and rapid rise. Their share in the same period grew from five to 22 percent. While the Catholics are holding during the years of he 20th century at just more than 120 million members, not decreasing, but not increasing either, while the number of Protestants has grown only since 2000 from 26 to 42 million.

By Protestant, is not meant the Lutheran or Reformed churches known in Northern Hemisphere. In Brazil this historical strand of Protestantism does not flower, but the Pentecostals and Evangelicals do. One in five Brazilians belongs to a group of younger Protestant sects which were imported from the United States to the Latin American country. Since then, several new communities that have arisen in Brazil, the Igreja Pentecostal Deus é Amor (IPDA).

On a smaller scale, other religions have grown in recent decades. Most through immigration. Within the country, the number of followers of syncretic Afro-Brazilian spiritualist cults such as Umbanda and Candomblé increased from six million in 2000 to ten million.

In 1970 there were less than a million without a religion, the number of agnostics and atheists has grown to 15 million.

The changes occur as a phenomenon in both women and men, among educated and less educated. It is more pronounced among the under-50s. One difference is particularly visible between the cities and the rural areas. While the country is still 78 percent Catholic, it is in the urban areas at only 62 percent where the Evangelicals and Pentecostals are particularly active, but also the number of atheists and agnostics is greater.

In Rio de Janeiro, the goal of Pope Francis, Catholics are at 46 percent only a minority. The aim of the Pope is to breathe new missionary life with his first trip to Latin America of the Brazilian church. A new vitality that is able to stop and reverse the trend and that radiates to other Latin American countries.

Pope Francis accepted the council of Pope Benedict XVI., with whom he meets in recent times more and more frequently, and prayed yesterday before the miraculous image the The Virgin of Rome in the Basilica Santa Maria Maggiore.

In the coming days Pope Francis will show how he presents the trend reversal against the erosion process of the Catholic Church to Protestant Pentecostals, agnostic and non-religious syncretistic African animist cults.

Text: Settimo Cielo / Giuseppe Nardi

Image: PEW

Trans: Tancred vekron99@hotmail.com

Link to katholisches...

Sunday, March 3, 2013

Jesus Instead of Jihad -- Every Year Six Million Muslims Convert to Christianity

(Cairo / Abuja) Islamist violence is rapidly increasing in Africa.  Muslim terrorist groups increasingly operate in countries which were, until recently,  calm and stable as the Islamist wildfire spreads. The sociologist Massimo Introvigne was the OSCE Representative against persecution and discrimination of Christians in 2011.  He sees a targeted strategy beyond the phenomenon of Islamic violence. "The Islamists are convinced that the decisive battle about whether the world is Muslim or Christian will take place in Africa."  Even more important to Introvigne is, "that Islam is going to lose this battle. So it responds with bombs. "
It was the Libyan Islamic scholar and director of a training center for Imams and preacher of the Koran, Sheikh Ahmad Al-Qataani, who already proposed to raise the alarm a few years ago in an interview with the Arab-Muslim television channel Al-Jazeera. He did it with a highly explosive statement largely ignored in the West: "In Africa alone, every hour, 667 Muslims convert to Christianity, 16,000 every day, six million a year."  Introvigne confirmed the figures, which are now the same as in 2006, when Al-Qataani raised the alarm. African Christianity has a great inner strength. The contact of Muslims to Christianity led millions of Muslims to be baptized. One could say that they "fled" leave Islam. Despite the associated dangers to life and limb

Motion conversion from Islam to Christianity not only in Africa

The conversion movement from Islam to Christianity is found not only to take place in Africa. The baptism of the former Egyptian Muslim, Magdi Allam by Pope Benedict XVI. at the Easter Vigil in 2008 was the most spectacular and most visible element of this movement.  In addition Allam adopted, like many Muslim converts,  a typical Christian name. He opted for Cristiano. This refers to the personal name Christian. In his case, however,  Allam gave a broader message that will say: Magdi "the Christian" Allam, not the Muslim.
Empirical studies are not available. Careful observers, like the sociologist Introvigne, can based on various criteria of that largely unnoticed phenomenon, however is pouring in  approximate numbers. According to the British Times 15 percent  of immigrants to Europe have abandoned Islam and Muslims have become Christians. In the UK the number is now estimated at 200,000. In France, every year about 15,000 Muslims become Christians. Some 10,000 of them Catholics, the rest Protestants of various denominations, especially of independent churches.

Growth of Islam only by high birth rate in Islamic states - Christianity is growing by adult baptisms

In Africa, such as Sheikh Al-Qataani complained to Al-Jazeera, "Islam has always been the main religion. There were times when 30 African languages were ​​written in Arabic script. "Today's size relationship between Islam and Christianity makes it clear how much Islam has declined in recent years. Al-Qataani stated in his interview that there was  a direct comparison between Islam and the Catholic Church, "other Christian denominations were not added into the count”. With the increase in the number of Christians and the millions of Muslims who convert to Christianity, said Sheikh Al-Qataani: "These are huge numbers."
Introvigne confirms the conversion movement against the initially expressed assumption Al Qataani could have estimated the numbers intentionally increased to arouse the Islamic world. "The global growth of Islam is almost exclusively from the high birth rates in Muslim countries where thanks to Western medicine, infant mortality could be reduced substantially," said Introvigne. Outside the Islamic States of Islam is clearly in decline. The growth of Christianity in contrast, results mainly adult baptisms. The Evangelical Wolfgang Simpson wrote: "Over the past two decades, more Muslims came to Christ than in all previous centuries."

Father Joseph Hergets evangelization of Muslims

Priests, like the Austrian Lazarist Father Josef Herget, the founder of the Institute St. Justin in Mariazell, are among the silent but still active missionaries who lead the Muslims from Islam to Christ. They live dangerously. Father Herget wrote back in 1975, when the issue of Islam in the West has been given little weight, his master's thesis on the topic: Christian Preaching in the Islamic World. Another, the Egyptian Coptic priest and Islamic Scholar Zakaria Botros was described by the Arab-Islamic newspaper Al-Insan al-Jadid as the "number one enemy of Islam.”  Botros’ broadcast via satellite from the U.S., in which he explains from a Christian perspective, the problematic parts of the Koran (Jihad, status of women, stonings, etc.) may lead to secret mass conversions among Muslims. His mastery of the Arabic language and his knowledge of Islamic sources allow him to contact directly to an Arab-Muslim audience in the Middle East.
The conversions were initiated, as many viewers of Channel Botros Alfady,  after initial outrage it was clear that the Ulema are not able to convincingly answer Botros’ broadcasts. Botros like Hergets is dealing with Islam differently from the usual Western criticism that focuses on political and social issues and often betrays a condescending bigoted undertone. This form of criticism is also a cause for the fact that many in the West ignore the Christians of the Middle East and North Africa. Such criticism, which is seen as prejudiced, external interference, to close to the majority of Muslims. They usually respond downright irritated or filling not least on the ranks of Islamist movements,  militias and terrorist groups because too many politically charged issues come into play, in which the West is not perceived as the morally superior side, but mutated into an enemy. Botros and Herget, to stay with the two representatives of the evangelization of Muslims, on the other hand,point to salvation. This is the crucial difference that they will open the hearts of many Muslims, and at the same time offer a way out of a spiral of violence with harsh confrontations.

Radical Islam can be defused only by religion, not secularism, materialism and feminism

Raymond Ibrahim wrote in the National Review: "Many Western critics fail to appreciate that, to disempower Islam (radical or otherwise), something theocentric and spiritually satisfying — not secularism, democracy, capitalism, materialism, feminism, etc. — must be offered in its place. The falsehoods of Islam can only be challenged and supplanted by the truths of God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. And so "Father Zakaria Botros has been fighting fire with fire" and so must we." 
People seem to bear no longer the direct or indirect violence. Roman Silantjew, secretary of the Interreligious Council of Russia, said that in the successor states of the former Soviet Union, two million Muslims converted to Christianity.  One of the main reasons for this is the desire for peace that they recognize in Christianity.

Two million converts in Russia, 250,000 in Malaysia, 80,000 in Algeria

In Algeria, there were approximately 80,000 Muslims who were baptized, which prompted the country's government to enact laws against Christian proselytism. In these years, Moroccan media continued its complaint against the baptism of tens of thousands Berber. People see in war and crisis zones, how Islam is and they decide for Christ, as the representative of an evangelical community in Sudan said.
In Malaysia, said the Mufti of Perak of 250,000 Muslims that have submitted officially to the authority the application for change of religion to Christianity. Such a change is only allowed for members of ethnic minorities. On the number of Malays who were baptized in secret, there is no information.

People recognize Christianity as a religion of peace, Islam as a religion of violence

Protestant and Pentecostal communities are very decisive. Sometimes they are irresponsible to the distress of the indigenous Christian churches in Islamic countries who are victims of Islamist reprisals. The Catholic Church is more reserved. The Egyptian Jesuit Samir Khalil Samir, a leading expert in the Islamic world and the Pope's adviser, complained that the Catholic clergy "discourages for fear or misunderstood, 'ecumenism ', sometimes even to advise against conversions" in Islamic states. It’s not different  in European countries. The situation is admittedly says Khalil, not easy. Free Church communities "come and go, the Church has lasted 2000 years, it is here today and it will be tomorrow."  Free Church groups, because of their small structures  are barely palpable. likewise because they are in not officially recorded in most countries. Therefore, they are not vulnerable to attack. Quite different is the situation of the Catholic Church and the Eastern Churches. You are officially registered. The authorities know all the Christian places and know the families that belong to Church. They are vulnerable to attack because of its visibility and not only in a particular country, but also in other countries.

Differences between evangelical communities and the Catholic Church

The indigenous churches were accustomed coexistence with Muslims for centuries and in a certain form. A form which allows a convert to Islam, but not vice versa toward Christianity. The long time and the Islamic sword they had resigned themselves to defend their own area but not to reach from it. It is a form of self-defense, which is firmly entrenched in the mentality of the Eastern Christians, and could only be overcome slowly. Overcoming, which Christians very much require, is often given to life-threatening situations.
Missionaries from the outside would have, however, often lack the necessary familiarity with the cultural sensitivities, which could lead to dangerous confusion among the Muslim population. Between these extremes, it was necessary to find ways of evangelization. Working in this field are several Catholic initiatives, such as those of the Austrian Father Josef Herget and his Catechetical education.
Text: Giuseppe Nardi
Image: Dad News

Link to Katholisches...

Friday, November 16, 2012

Germany Stuck in a Downward Spiral

© Paolo Margari,
Flickr, 
CC BY-NC-ND
The future belongs to lands who population is young and where many children are born.  No state can be made with homosexual madness and the abortion of children.

(kreuz.net) German economy will be doing penance because of the age of its population till 2060-- more than other industrial lands.

That is the result of a far future study by the Paris based 'Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development' (OECD)

Fall Back to 10th Place

The German economy will only grow 1.1 percent till 2060 every year.

In the coming fifty years no other industrial country will lose so intensely its social significance than Germany.

The country will fall in the list of national economies from 5th place to 10th.

German Rest Home

The reason for this is the aging of the decadent and demoralized population.

The study shows that the portion of those over 65 years of age -- compared to the spread of age between 15 to 64 years -- will double to almost 65%.

 The share of Germany in world gross national production will fall from 2 to 4.8%.

It gets worse

The winners of the study are China, India and Indonesia.

Their economic weight results in great part from their significant populations.

The OECD insists then that these forecasts over such long periods of time are bound with significant uncertainties.

In other words:  It could be worse.

Link to kreuz.net...

Monday, October 15, 2012

News Bytes: The Rotten Fruits of the Council -- Will the Church Become a Mosque?

France:  The Rotten Fruits of the Council -- Will the Church become a Mosque? -- Homosexual Bullying Bears Fruit -- Went off Quickly Without a Hitch -- Now Come the Clones

France.  In 1961 -- a year before the start of the Pastoral Council -- 35% of the French went to the Latin Mass of the Roman Rite every Sunday.  Fifty years later, after the start of the Second Vatican Council only 6% of the French -- at least once a month -- attend the New Eucharistic Celebration.  This is from a study of the public opinion researcher 'Ifop'.  In 1961 over 90% of Frenchmen were Catholic.  Now about 80% are baptized.  In all, about 30% of those under 35 are approximately 30% heathen.

Will the Church Become a Mosque?

France.  One Church in the 27,000 population city of Vierzon in central France may become a Mosque.  In the city there are six churches and 300 practicing Catholics.  That's why the church, St. Eloi, built in 1955 will be sold.  The buyer shows itself to be the "Union of Moroccans".  It will transform the church into a Mosque.  The Diocese of Bourges explained that it is still not decided to whom the will be sold off for peanuts.

Homosexual Intimidation Bears Fruit

Austria.  On Saturday the Salzburg Auxiliary Bishop Andreas Laun celebrates his 70th birthday.  On his jubilee, a homosexual website congratulated him.  Msgr. Laun has refrained from commenting on the disorder.  Recently he even expressed himself in friendly terms to homosexuals and spoke of a "loving interaction" with them.

Trial Went off Quickly Without a Hitch

Vatican.  Was there secret fixing involved with the Pope-traitor Paolo Gabrielle?  This question came from the anti-Church German weekly 'Zeit'.  It is incidental that the actors of State Attorney and defense announced the judgment:  "There will possibly be a verdict before the trial's end."  Gabriele's attorney has praised the judgment as balanced.  Also, there is still the big question if there is another suspect besides Gabriele.  The Journalist Marco Ansaldo from the Italian news 'Republica' described the trial as a "fixed trial".

Now comes the Clone

Sweden.  In this year there are two stem cell researchers, the Japanese Shinya Yamanaka and the Brit John Gurdon, who will win the Nobel Prize for Medicine.  They are to receive the dubious honor for the back development of cells of a grown person from embryonic stem cells.  For that it will no longer be necessary to grow and kill more children, in order to experiment with their cells.  Archbishop Anton Losinger of Augsburg warned 'Munich Kirchenradio', that this may lead to the technique of making identical clones.

Link to kreuz.net...

Wednesday, August 15, 2012

18 Young Novices Are Vested in the Franciscans of the Immaculata

Edit: this really speaks for itself in many ways.

(Avellino) On the 1st of August a investiture of the new novices took place for the Franciscans of the Immaculata.  18 young women were given the habit in the tradition bound cloister in the presence of the General Superior of the Franciscans of the Immaculata, Father Stefano Maria Manelli, at the Pilgrimage site of the Madonna del Buon Consiglio of Frigento in Avellino, Italy.  For the occasion, Father Gabriele Pellettieri said Holy Mass in the Immemorial Rite.

The sight of such a large number of young women, receiving the veil of a religious order, has become a rarity in Europe.  Before the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificum, allowed by Pope Benedict XVI, the women's branch of this young, tradition bound Franciscan order has had about 10 entrants to its Italian novitiate yearly.  Since then their population has almost doubled, as the blog Cordialiter noted.

"The classical form of the Roman Rite is a true treasure for the Church, it increases priestly and religious vocations.  Should the trend hold, in 50 years the majority will be of the new, tradition bound orders or old orders, who have been restored to tradition", says Cordialiter.

The Franciscans of the Immaculata were founded in 1982 as a women's branch of the Franciscan Order of the Immaculata founded in 1970 by two friars.  In the beginning of the 80s a group of young women decided to lead a Franciscan and Marian life a severity.  The first convent was formed from the Philippines and received recognition by the Diocese through the Archbishop of Manila.  In 1988 three sisters founded the first convent in Italy, which was recognized by the Archabbot of Monte Cassino.  In 1998, Papal recognition as  Society of Apostolic Life was given.

At the present there are more than 300 sisters worldwide in 47 houses, of which 15 are found in Europe.

Text: Cordialiter/Giuseppe Nardi
Bild: Cordialiter

Link to katholisches....



Monday, August 6, 2012

The Media Bosses Don't Want the Old Mass

That the devil has something against the Mass of All Ages, can not be gainsaid.
The Devil Hates the Old Mass
© Lawrence OP, Flickr, CC

(kreuz.net)  On July 12th the anti-Catholic newspaper 'Donaukurier' disparaged the blooming of the Old Mass in Germany.

Old Liberals Aren't Catholic

The paper used language like "churchgoers will understand"

In reality there are no church-goers in the entire history of the Church who are as much without understanding as the participants of the New Rite.

Or:  "In Germany we have only a few Catholics who have an interest in the celebration of the Mass in the Latin Rite."

The Problem:  The paper is indicating grey haired Old Liberals fallen from the Faith as Catholics.

These gentrified circles were even described by the "Donaukurier" as "Catholic Reformers".

The Liturgical Apparatus Doesn't Want
There is no advocacy of the Old Mass expected also from Stephan Steger -- the Old Liberal Liturgist for the  Diocese of Wurzburg.

Two Old Masses int he Diocese are enough for the Old Believers -- he hopes.

Completely, totally few

In the Archdiocese of Freiburg there are "but six Parishes" with the Old Mass -- he further attested for the 'Donnaukurier'.

In the Diocese of Bamberg it is only celebrated in five churches.

In the Archdiocese of Bamberg it is only celebrated in five churches.

In Eichstatt one speaks only of a "handfull of Churches" and an allegedly "small group".


In the Diocese of Mainz the Old Mass is only given in six parishes.

The Archdiocese of Paderborn is open for the Old Mass only in "few churches".

The Diocese Don't Want It


The Reality is more brutal.

In the Archdiocese of Freiburg there are about two Mass locations where the Old Mass is celebrated every Sunday.

In the Archdicoese of Bamberg there are Old Masses celebrated only at 8am or at 7pm.

In the Diocese of Eichstatt and in the Diocese of Mainz there are four locations with the Old Mass on Sunday, in the Archdiocese of Paderborn, one.

A thorn in the side

Naturally, Diocesan priests, who celebrate the Old Mass, have to deal with reprisals from their superiors and parish communities.

Actually:  Despite the general resistance to the Old Mass people --- in contrast to the softly core of the New Believers -- are highly motivated Catholics.

It is then no wondewr that the Old Liturgy is a thorn in the side of the enemies of the Church.

Link to kreuz.net...















Wednesday, November 16, 2011

In Russia, Two Out of Three Trust Church


In Europe, only one out of three trusts their church.

Moscow (kath.net/KNA) 68 percent of the Russian people have shown in a recent questionnaire that they have trust in the Orthodox Church of their land. Only twelve percent have mistrust for the Church, as a public poll conducted by the religious information service >>Sreda<<.

A subscriber poll of the "Reader's Digest" (Stuttgart) of Europeans in 16 countrie shows that 38 percent distrust their churches, while 59 percent on the other hand have little or no confidence.

30 percent of Russians surveyed see a strong dependence of their church on the State, 25 percent see it as low. 30 percent of respondents want the official state religion to be Orthodoxy. The majority of 48 percent, however disagrees that church and state should remain separate.


53 percent appreciate the work of the Russian Orthodox Moscow Patriarch Kirill I very much; another 40 percent rate it as mediocre, however, the remaining 7 percent below average.

In contrast, Europe (16 European countries including Russia), the Churches and Ecclesial Communities and their representatives, enjoy in comparison to other institutions, below-average confidence. This came from the aforementioned consumer survey by "Reader's Digest" (Stuttgart) which appeared at the end of March 2011. 38 percent of the approximately 33,000 respondents trust the churches there, 59 percent have little or no confidence in them.

The trust shown for churches in Germany is about a third (34 percent), while in the previous year was 40 percent. Even more dramatic is the fall in their trust in the Switzerland where it fell from 43 percent to 34 percent. There was only a slight loss in the prestige churches in Austria - from 37 percent to 36 percent.

In this pan-European survey, Russia was also included at the time, because the investigation "Reader's Digest European Trusted Brands" (Reader's Digest trusted brands) since 2001, has been conducted annually in the following countries: Belgium, Germany, Croatia, Finland, France, the Netherlands, Austria, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Russia, Slovenia, Sweden, Switzerland, Czech Republic and Hungary.

Photo: (c) the Church in Need

Wednesday, September 7, 2011

Germany: Over 85 Percent of German Catholics are Dead Letter

Now here comes the Old Liberal prescription:  More homosexual depravity, divorce, birth control and ecumenism as well as married priests will bring people into the Church in droves.

(kreuz.net) 87.4 of those German Catholics freed by the Pastoral Council, don't practice their religion.

This comes from statistics compiled on the website of the German Bishops' Conference.

The data collected is from 2010.

 The Diocese of Erfurt is in the Lead

The most Catholic areas in Germany are in the former areas of Communist East Germany.

The reason for this exceptional situation is probably due to the fact that the Church there had been free of the Conciliar decadence, the capitalistic excess and the ecclesiastical sexual insanity.

Otherwise the Church in the old DDR was shut off from politics.  They had to stick by-- for good or evil --  their basic job description.

The German leader is the Diocese of Erfurt of allm things.   This is where the Apostate Martin Luther entered the Augustinian Order in 1505.

In the Diocese the number of practicing Catholics soars to an underwhelming  21.4 percent.

In Gorlitz and Dresden-Meissen 20.7 percent of Catholics take part in their ecclesiastical life.

In the West: Regensburg Leads

In West Germany the Diocese of Regensburg has the highest number of practicing Catholicsin the West  at 19.9 percent.

This Diocese serves as a natural victim so that the anti-Church meia bosses, in order to alienate the Faithful there from the Church by way of a media campaign.

In second place is the Diocese of  Eichstätt with 18.6 percent.

Then comes Fulda (16.9), Würzburg (16.0), Augsburg (15.9) und Passau (15.1).

The sad light of dusk is falling on the Diocese of Essen (9.5), Aachen (9.7) und Hildesheim (9.9).

Not much better are the Diocese of  Hamburg (10.3), Cologne (10.5) und Mainz (10.7).

Link to original...kreuz.net...


Tuesday, March 29, 2011

Rick Santorum Says Abortion Makes Problems for Social Security

Editor: Interesting. it was never a good investment anyway. Sounds like someone wants to be President.

CONCORD, N.H. — In his latest trip to New Hampshire, Republican Rick Santorum says the Social Security system would be in much better shape if there were fewer abortions.

The former Pennsylvania senator and potential presidential candidate was asked about Social Security during an interview on WESZ-AM radio in Laconia on Tuesday morning.

He says the system has design flaws, but the reason it is in big trouble is that there aren't enough workers to support retirees. He blamed that on what he called the nation's abortion culture. He says that culture, coupled with policies that do not support families, deny America what it needs – more people.

Link to huffpost...

Santorum has been a frequent visitor to New Hampshire, which holds the earliest presidential primary.
Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...